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On Political Deals

I’m sure some in the Liberal Blogging Community will paint this as the NDP making a deal with the devil or that its suspicious the NDP’s environment critic Nathan Cullen happens to coincidentally have a lot of the rainforest in his riding.

However, Martin did the same thing in his first year of minority government to stave off defeat for awhile by dealing with the NDP on the budget, and at least this deal will go toward protecting some vital rainforest in BC. If that’s the price of the NDP’s support for the Tories, then I certainly can live with that. I want to see however what they are demanding from them on the Clean Air Act Amendments.


11 comments to On Political Deals

  • Budd Campbell:

    You will note I made clear I was unsure and followed it with that “if” immediately after stating my uncertaintly. As well, my only point regarding if it was the same MP was whether that would indicate a closer relationship there are well as the one already existing between Layton and Harper which I might point out was where the thrust of my comment was aimed. If you think you have made any movement in trying to discredit me or make me look like a fool this is only further evidence of your tendency to overstate/exaggerate as you did with your choice of what to critique and mock from my comment and how much more you read into it than was actually there.

  • There is zero reported evidence of any two-party “deal” — nothing outside Liberal Caucus talking points — certainly nothing to justify Woods’ craft-offending headline or speculation.

    The Star and the Globe have both done this: headlines straight from the Liberal’s mouths, nothing but speculation to back them up in the article.

  • Jay

    I’m with Scott: let’s look to the concrete substance of the amendments and what emerges on the other side.

    BTW, it occurs to nobody here that Woods at the Star has been had by his “sources”? There is zero reported evidence of any two-party “deal” — nothing outside Liberal Caucus talking points — certainly nothing to justify Woods’ craft-offending headline or speculation.

  • Grace

    Budd, I’m glad you liked my comment. If you actually understood basic comprehension, I was merely stating that providing funding to protect a rain forest that many in the north don’t perceive as being under attack won’t suddenly woo people over to voting for either Nathan Cullen or whatever reformer the “conservatives” run in the area.

    If they actually wanted to win the vote in that area they would do something about the farm fishing. State in no uncertain terms they will settle land claims with the Tsimshian, Haisla, Gitxsan, etc., in the area before they start drilling for oil (something they’ve been wanting to do). If they were concerned about the eco-system, they’d have heavy fines – or at least the threat – to people who harvest abalone and other shellfish from the sea when they are a threatened species.

    If they were worried about the environment in northern BC they wouldn’t have cut the funding for pine beetle when all you have to do is drive to Prince George and see how it’s slowly making it’s way to the Northern part of the province and ravaging the trees.

    If they were concerned about the environment they would do something about the seine fishing that happens and continually depletes the salmon stock.

    I am from the area. And no vote in the riding is secure despite throwing money at the “Spirit Bear” Rainforest.

    Yes, it’s great they’re doing it. But when people go to the polls on voting day they won’t be going there with the mind that, “oh they saved a part of the countryside so it means they care and they’re doing something.”

    If you want to get into a debate about Northwestern BC, please, feel free. But don’t make a statement about what I state, being from that region of the province, without offering up your own points that prove me wrong and instead choosing to twist words, offering up your own dialogue and meaning to what I said and generally make a complete fool of yourself. It’s a typical republican approach to debates when they cannot offer facts themselves.

    If you want, we can discuss anger in the area of the billion dollar softwood lumber sellout while that particular area of the province suffers from high unemployment. Want to talk about that?

  • Budd Campbell

    It’s amusing to read the rants from Grace and Scotian.

    I loved Grace’s statements that she is from the area and knows the people, and since the geography is beautiful, preserving the Central Coast rainforest and ecosystems will mean nothing. Only jobs will win votes. Can we quote that to her Leader Dion when he is in full flight doing his faux environmentalist schtick?

    Scotian claims observes that Cullen and Baird had worked together to get the Accountability Act passed. Scotian, that was Pat Martin on the Accountability Act. You didn’t mention the obstruction from Liberal Senators wanting to raise the donation limit to $2000 from $1000. Why leave this valiant Liberal effort out of your version of events?

    Scotian, any time you want to talk about hypocrisy and arrogance, please do so. Coming from you and your party, these rants will be shining exemplars of how to act as if you were just born to rule.

  • Wasn’t it Cullen that Baird worked with to ram the Accountability Act through the Parliamentary committee last year? If so then I have to wonder whether there is more going on behind the scenes between not just the CPC and NDP leaders but between these two particular MPs. As it is I am finding painful listening to Cullen talk about Liberal hypocrisy while working with the one party and party leader most responsible for making it harder to try and do anything on this issue for the last five+ years. This is smacking more and more of the ongoing mutual agenda of destroying the Liberals that the NDP and CPC have been engaged in since mid 2005 than anything else, and that is not a good motivation for working together in Parliament IMHO and is *not* proof of the oft repeated NDP spin of only being interested in making government work unlike other parties. While I can understand Layton’s desire to take what he can from the Liberals, is it worth the cost of giving Harper increased credibility as a “moderate/centrist” PM and not all that dangerous to the Canadian political structure and especially to the progressive agenda that Liberals, NDPers and most BQists believe in if left in power, let alone given even one majority?

    Either Layton is too ingnorant/arrogant to recognize the true danger Harper represents to core NDP principles and agendas, or worse he does but feels it is worth it if he can replace the Liberals as the alternative governing party from the left. I know Harper and his strain of conservatism would decentralize federal powers massively if it had a majority, it has been Harper’s consistant stated mission since the late 80s until late 2005. Even if Harper only had one majority and then the Layton NDP came to power as a government it would find that many of the tools it would need to advance national social programs would have been gutted by Harper. So is it worth becoming the governing party if in the process you allow the main tools you need to advance your core agenda/beliefs to be irrevocably lost/destroyed as a byproduct of gaining power? I don’t think so and I doubt many real NDP believers would as well, and those that do see this risk appear to be the ones pulling away from the Layton NDP and moving either Liberal or Green instead.

  • Grace

    Nathan Cullen’s re-election is not secure. In fact, some of his NDP supporters have walked away (my Mom being one) because of Jack Layton.

    I’m originally from that riding and have contemplated in the past of running there as a liberal.

    As much of a fuss that has been made about the ethnic voting in Khan’s riding, the same holds true in the Skeena-Bulkley riding regarding First Nations.

    Prior to Cullen’s “surprise” election in 2003 was because a lot of the First Nations Peoples decided to stop their vote splitting (amongst the liberals and ndpers) that allowed first the Reform and then the Alliance to squeak into the seat. In fact, in his victory speech Cullen thanked all the First Nations communities in the area for his victory.

    Securing a rain forest in the area when the economy is crap, there are no jobs and there’s nothing down the pipe bringing jobs isn’t going to win him another election.

    It all depends on who the liberals decide to run against the NDP. If they get the support of the various First Nations in the area and have a great ground crew working, it’s entirely winnable. Of course they’d have to get someone that’s also a reflection of the cities/towns in the area of kitimat, terrace, smithers, burns lake etc.

    My point is, since most of the area in Northern BC is very prestine and beautiful, naturally, them throwing money for environmental protection means nothing.

    Also, the area is starting to be ravaged by the pine beetle and since it’s mainly forest industry, cutting funding for the pine beetle ticked a lot of people off.

    Federally between the NDP and the Conservatives it might be viewed as a “good faith” approach but it in no way secures Cullen’s seat with his constituents.

    By the way, I also received a report from the APC and the Skeena-Bulkley riding is one of interest to the liberals to take in an election.

  • Except it was hassle enough for me to switch to the new blogger.

    Blogger is the online equivalent of owning a Lada.

  • BigCityLib asked:

    [quote comment=”1221″]Is something wrong with blogger such that the aggregators are not picking up posts? Very little seems to be happening of Prog Blog today.[/quote]

    If you were to read a diary there by Eugene Plawiuk here, you’d see that Blogger has had a manor screwup (dunno if its fixed as of this comment), and since probably 80-90% of our affiliates use Blogger.. that certainly would cause a slowdown of feeds.

    I’m with Debra on this one :em19: And, I’ll campaign for WordPress any day of the week. :em69:

  • Definitely smells, and makes you think the Dippers will deal away on the topic of carbon emissions for trinkets in other areas. We shall have to see, however.

    Is something wrong with blogger such that the aggregators are not picking up posts? Very little seems to be happening of Por Blog today.

  • Well that will secure Nathan’s re-election anyway, if nothing else.

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